Who Champions Your Film After the Deal? Part 1

What does it take to go from fixing sewing machines to sitting across from buyers at Netflix?

Film distribution is a people business, and this conversation proves it. Long before streaming, Joe Amodei fell in love with a store full of VHS tapes. Decades later, his first acquisition as an independent distributor was Super Size Me. Part 2: listen to Part 2

In Episode 233, Christian sits down with Joe Amodei, founder of Virgil Films and Entertainment, and his partner Tim Maggiani, the company's co-president, for the first of two conversations. Virgil distributes Christian's film The Girl Who Wore Freedom. They aren't paying to be here; this episode is sponsored by Artillery Sports.

Christian opens by saying something filmmakers rarely say: she trusts her distributor. Then the two of them show why. Joe still walks into rooms at the big streamers and pitches each film himself. Tim takes the fear out of delivery and keeps finding promotions for films in their third and fourth years. And Christian and Joe talk through why Virgil keeps its roster small. As Joe puts it, "we do not make money unless the filmmaker is making money."

In this episode, you'll learn:

• How Joe went from repairing sewing machines in Philadelphia to district manager of an 18-store video chain
• How Super Size Me, the first film Joe acquired, put his company on the map
• How Tim Maggiani turned a 2004 internship into Virgil's digital business
• Why your distributor should go direct to each platform, and what a middleman can cost you
• What Joe says when he pitches a film to a streaming buyer
• How Tim builds a pitch deck for each platform
• What delivery means, from ProRes files to platform specs, and what can be negotiated
• Why Virgil keeps promoting films for years and looks for evergreen titles
• Why key art has to read at thumbnail size
• Why Virgil keeps its roster small on purpose

Chapters

0:00 A Distributor Worth Trusting

3:02 Joe's Video Store Beginnings

8:26 Tim's Digital Shift

18:35 Pitching Buyers in Person

23:25 Decks, Delivery, Contracts

31:25 Selling Evergreen Titles

34:38 Standing Out Without Billboards

38:06 Forks Over Knives Dinner

42:48 Small Roster by Choice

46:50 DocuView Deja View Picks

Frequently Asked Questions

How do I know if a film distributor has real relationships with the platforms?

Ask whether they deal with each platform directly. Joe Amodei of Virgil Films told Documentary First in 2024 that a lot of distributors won't tell you they lack those relationships. When a distributor has to route your film through another company to reach a platform, the filmmaker can end up paying a double or even triple fee. His advice is to confirm your distributor can go straight to the accounts.

What is film delivery, and why does it scare filmmakers?

Delivery is the set of files and materials a distributor needs to put your film on each platform. Tim Maggiani of Virgil Films told Documentary First in 2024 that it usually starts with an Apple ProRes mezzanine file, which his team transcodes to each platform's specs. He said the list looks daunting on paper, but in practice it's simpler than it reads, and some requirements can be negotiated.

How do independent films keep selling years after release?

Through steady promotion. Joe Amodei told Documentary First in 2024 that Virgil Films keeps pitching each title to platforms in years two, three and four, often grouping films into price drops such as a 99 cent week. Tim Maggiani said one of the important decisions Virgil makes in acquiring a film is whether it's evergreen, because you want a film that keeps working, not one with a short window.

What does a pitch to a streaming buyer sound like?

Joe Amodei of Virgil Films acted one out on Documentary First in 2024, using The Girl Who Wore Freedom. He tells the buyer the story and why it will move them, then covers the street date, the filmmaker and her other projects. Sometimes he shows the trailer, depending on the room. He calls it a classic pitch, and said he still makes it face to face with buyers at the big streamers.

DocuView Deja View Picks

Tim Maggiani: Just One Mile (2023), about a one-mile loop race that keeps going until one runner is left standing.

Joe Amodei: 7 Yards: The Chris Norton Story, about a college football player paralyzed from the neck down and the life he built after.

Sponsored by Artillery Sports

artillerysports.com. Use code DocFirst for 10% off.

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About the Guests

Joe Amodei is the founder of Virgil Films and Entertainment. He started behind the counter of a Philadelphia video store, worked at Turner for five years and later ran an independent film division at USA, then co-founded the company that acquired Super Size Me as its first film. That company was later sold to him personally and renamed Virgil Films.

Tim Maggiani is co-president of Virgil Films and Entertainment. He joined as an intern in New York in 2004, worked in viral marketing, and from around 2006 built the company's digital distribution business. He also handles pitch materials, delivery and ongoing promotions.

About Virgil Films and Entertainment

Virgil Films and Entertainment is an independent film distributor led by Joe Amodei. Its releases include Super Size Me, Restrepo, Forks Over Knives and I Am Chris Farley. Virgil distributes Christian's film The Girl Who Wore Freedom. virgilfilms.com

About Documentary First

Documentary First is a weekly podcast about the people behind documentaries and how the work changed them. Host Christian Taylor, director of the award-winning The Girl Who Wore Freedom, talks with filmmakers, distributors, entertainment lawyers, actors and more, from Ken Burns and PBS American Masters creator Susan Lacy to first-timers, across nearly 300 conversations. Each week brings one of two formats: a long-form conversation with the people behind films for HBO, Netflix, PBS and independent film, or The Deep Dive, where Christian takes one insight from a recent conversation and follows it wherever it leads. Listen Notes ranks the show in the top 5% of all podcasts worldwide. New episodes every week.

Resources Mentioned

• Virgil Films and Entertainment
• Artillery Sports
• Part 2 of this conversation
• Joe Amodei's first Documentary First visit (Ep. 128)