005. The Hidden Spiritual Cost of How We Work ft. Gary Hamel

What does it mean to treat people as ends in themselves rather than instruments to get things done? Gary Hamel joins John for a conversation about work, dignity, and the quiet crisis inside most organizations. One of the world's most influential business thinkers, Gary has spent decades asking why so few workplaces actually unleash the people inside them, and what it would look like if they did. This is a conversation about agency, meaning, and why the biblical vision of every human being made to reign with God has profound implications for how we build institutions.

About Gary Hamel

Gary Hamel is one of the world's most influential and iconoclastic business thinkers. He has worked with leading companies across the globe and is a dynamic and sought-after management speaker. Hamel has been on the faculty of the London Business School for more than 30 years and is the director of the Management Lab.

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What this Conversation Explores

• Why most organizations treat people as semi-programmable robots and what we stand to lose if we don't change that 
• The only three reasons someone actually needs to be managed, and why none of them require layers of hierarchy to solve
• What a 16,000-person Dutch healthcare company with almost no managers can teach us about trust, accountability, and human potential
• The biblical vision of dominion and kingdom, and why John argues it is the deepest possible framework for thinking about work and dignity
• Why the question is not how to outperform your peers but how to outperform expectations, and what that shift does to a person over time
• The four force multipliers Gary has observed in ordinary people who do extraordinary things: courage, contrarianism, community, and compassion
• Dallas Willard's vision of job discipleship, and what it looks like to do your work together with Jesus rather than merely alongside him
• How Gary thinks about faith, suffering, and the preponderance of evidence for belief in a world that has grown increasingly nihilistic

Resources Mentioned

• The Death of Common Sense — Philip K. Howard
• The Utopia of Rules — David Graeber
• Man's Search for Meaning — Viktor Frankl
• The Management Lab — mlabgroup.com

Connect with Gary Hamel

Website: garyhamel.com

About Formation

Formation is a podcast that explores the science and soul of spiritual formation. Each episode brings together the ancient wisdom of the contemplative tradition and the best of modern research. John Ortberg sits down with some of the most rigorous and honest thinkers working at the intersection of faith and human flourishing for extended, unhurried conversations about how we are being shaped. New episodes every other week, wherever you listen to podcasts.

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Website: formationpodcast.com
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Socials: @formationjohn

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