The Homeland Security Trap? with Russell Moore & Elizabeth Neumann

What America Learned, Feared, and Forgot After 9/11

Former Trump White House security expert Elizabeth Neumann and theologian Russell Moore join Curtis Chang to consider whether America is safer—or simply more afraid—25 years after 9/11. They examine the war with Iran, immigration enforcement, domestic extremism, government overreach, and the church's complicity in fear-driven efforts. Together, they ask how Christians can confront legitimate threats without surrendering to fear, offering civic engagement, moral courage, and faithful "small refusals" to conform as a way forward.

03:14 - A 25-Year Review of Homeland Security

06:22 - A Theological View on "Homeland Security"

09:55 - How Do We Evaluate the War with Iran?

19:34 - Should Christians Trust the State?

24:01 - The Public's Disengagement from Government

28:54 - The Church's Role in Local Justice

33:59 - The Rise of Domestic Terrorism

40:52 - Is the Church Complicit in Fear Mongering?

42:29- Russell's Counsel for Pastors: Small Refusals

44:39 - The Personal Cost of Opposing Government Overreach

48:22 - When Lament and Hope Are the Same Thing

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Mentioned in This Episode:

• Elizabeth Neumann's Kingdom of Rage: The Rise of Christian Extremism and the Path Back to Peace
• National September 11 Memorial & Museum: Marking the 25th Anniversary
• George W. Bush White House's the Department of Homeland Security executive Summary
• More about National Immigration Forum
• Wendell Berry's "A Statement Against the War in Vietnam" from The Long-Legged House

Scriptures:

• Hebrews 11:13–16 ESV
• Jeremiah 29:7 ESV
• 1 Samuel 8 ESV
• Romans 12–13 ESV
• Isaiah 8:11–13 ESV
• Romans 8:24–27 ESV

More From Elizabeth Neumann:

• Elizabeth Neumann's website

More From Russell Moore:

• Russell Moore's Substack
• Read Russell Moore's article The Trump-Era Laughter at Immigrant Suffering Is Deforming Our Souls
• Sign up for Russell Moore's weekly newsletter Moore to the Point

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The Good Faith Podcast is a production of a 501(c)(3) nonpartisan organization that does not engage in any political campaign activity to support or oppose any candidate for public office. Any views and opinions expressed by any guests on this program are solely those of the individuals and do not necessarily reflect the views or positions of Good Faith.