“The goalposts are shrouded, not moving” by philh

Alice: Are there any examples of X?
Bob: Here.
Alice: Okay, but are there any examples of X'?
Bob: Yes, here.
Alice: That has feature Y, which-
Bob: Dude, stop moving the goalposts.

The thing is, I think in this situation, Alice often isn't moving the goalposts. Instead, she's looking for something, and not fully specifying it up-front. Maybe because she's speaking imprecisely. Maybe because she doesn't know quite what she's looking for, but does know when she sees something that that's not it.

Alice: Any research showing that supplement helps?
Bob: Yes, here's a trial.
Alice: Anything not funded by the manufacturer?
Bob: This one was funded by the NIH.
Alice: Thanks, but it's n=12 and there's no control arm.
Bob: ಠ_ಠ

What Alice wants to know here is should she believe the supplement helps. Asking for research is a proxy for that, and the research Bob finds answers her proxy but doesn't say much about the real question.

This is probably frustrating for Bob! If he doesn't know why Alice is asking, or doesn't know why the things he finds don't help her, it might look to him a lot like she's moving [...]

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First published:
August 5th, 2026

Source:
https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/HPSHtrJtgPNaTdjxH/the-goalposts-are-shrouded-not-moving

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Narrated by TYPE III AUDIO.