The National Interest: Philip Cunliffe

The peak of globalization is behind us, and not merely due to the Trump administration’s trade and foreign policies. With states being forced anew to earn their position in the international order, a new debate about the meaning of their national interest is urgently needed.

The concept of ‘national interest’, however, is conspicuous from public life by its absence. All too often, the question is seen as parochial. Even political leaders, more used to making their case to the world at large than to their fellow citizens, treat the question of the national interest as an embarrassment.

In The National Interest, Philip Cunliffe suggests that states will not be able to rise to present challenges without the legitimacy conferred by the pursuit of the national interest.

Philip Cunliffe is Associate Professor in International Relations at UCL, co-founder of Bungacast, and author of multiple books on international politics and security.

This conversation was recoded at Verdurin in July 2025.

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